Can You Out-Train Your Genes After 50? Listener Questions Answered

Do genetics contribute to the effects of aging for cyclists in their 50s?

Absolutely. I mean, I think just with everything in life as animals in the animal kingdoms,

they always say, choose your parents wisely. So genetics is, it's 50 % of that contribution, nature,

But what you can control is the environmental factors, right? And this is called also termed epigenetic signaling.

Hello and welcome to the Athletes Compass podcast where we navigate training, fitness and health for everyday athletes. Paul and Marjaana we have a boatload of questions this week. Let's dive in. Our first question comes from Jeff Abbott from Facebook. Do genetics contribute to the effects of aging for cyclists in their 50s?

Yeah.

Yeah, sure does. Absolutely. I mean, I think just with everything in life as animals in the animal kingdoms, as they always say, choose your parents wisely. So genetics is, it's 50 % of that contribution, nature, nurture. ⁓ But there's not really too much you can do. So like, again, you've... ⁓

You have the parents that you have, you have the gene pool that you have. So ⁓ yeah, that's going to make a contribution. But what you can control is the environmental factors, right? And this is called also termed epigenetic signaling. And all of the environmental, I guess, factors come in to have a play on your own genetics.

All right, so, and it doesn't matter what factor that might be, whether it's heat or nutrition signals or exercise training signals. All of those are having genetic influences on your DNA. So that's what you can control and keep that in mind. So irrespective of the answer to that question, Jeff. ⁓

think about what you can control and work on those factors.

So Jeff, go ride your bike.

That's right.

Yeah.

I would also add, as an endurance athlete that is aging, I've had super fun summer training with my 14-year-old. And I just can't stop thinking that as I age, it's so good for me to train with him because he's developing his power, his strength, his speed while I am 47 and I'm trying to hang on to those.

as long as I can. So training with him has been so amazing this summer. And I just like, I just love training with him, lifting weights, sprinting and doing some.

development workouts. So don't forget to do those sprints while you're cycling there.

Yeah.

Totally. Yeah, like it's the overall package of the different training stimuli that you want to get. And each one of those makes a signal on your, ⁓ you know, your genetic blueprint. And each one of those makes a contribution to a factor that should in theory reduce the rate of aging. That's what we're all sort of trying to do here, right? So learn what those are as best you can, knowledge is power, and then work towards

the process of getting those signals, right? And some of the key ones are alleviating stress. I just returned from 48 hours of ⁓ tech detox, camping off grid, and it was fantastic. And ⁓ was fantastic because I just can totally reduce the overall stress that life has on all of us, myself included. So that was sort of wonderful.

Stress is another one of those factors, and that can be psychological stress, ⁓ mental stress. It can be a positive, it is a positive, but it can be a negative too if it's ⁓ not received in a balanced sort of way. It's all about balance at the end of the way. So get your stressors in a balanced factor. Always make sure that you alleviate those stresses.

favorite athlete, Grant Koisman asks, why... ⁓ He's got good comments on Strava, so hi Grant. ⁓ Why do the pros still ride their bikes on off day during the Tour de France? I get the gist of it, but would like professor or coach Paul and MJ type answer. And how does the same thing apply to an everyday athlete?

Well that's a big call. Favorite athlete. You know a lot out there.

Yeah.

Okay.

Was my recovery walk today more beneficial than I realized?

Well, I'll go to, I'll start on that one, MJ. And for me, I go back to your performance profile chart. So this is on your overview tab or on charts and performance profile. So have a look at that. Now imagine yourself being a Tour de France athlete where you have a fitness level or a CTL way, way, way, way up high at the very top that it can be, right? Like you just theoretically can't be any higher.

Well, when you do nothing, you get like a massive drop in your fitness ultimately. So even in mathematically, like the theoretical mathematics, you need to actually continue to get that, to keep that acute training load up high. So the...

But you they've known this for ages, I think intuitively that they're always going to still sort of feel better if they do that. They need that stress, that exercise stress in there. And the mathematics actually supports that. So the long and the short of it is, is ultimately that that's, that's what they sort of should be doing even from a mathematical standpoint, because they don't want to reduce any of the fitness that they, that they have. It's the ride that they do do of three, four hours.

When they do eight hours a day, three, four hours is pretty low in their world. So everything's kind of relative. And again, the mathematics of fatigue and stress and recovery all support it.

What about physiologically? Flushing out lactate is not a thing anymore, is it?

No, definitely not. That's been disproven a long time ago, but you're right. That message still prevails that lactate is a metabolic fuel. It's a metabolic byproduct, but it can be broken down and used in Krebs cycle for your mitochondria. yeah, that's not how it's happening. There's no flushing of lactate. It just doesn't even work that way.

Yeah, don't think about that. It's more about the training load. And I would imagine almost there's some psychological, emotional ⁓ component that just kind of goes, but the athlete knows that they feel better when they do that. Don't take me away from my bike. Like this is my job. This is what I do. I spend six to eight hours on my bike every day. That's what I do. I'm tour de France rider. So yeah, again, three to four hours is a rest day.

And. ⁓

And so recovery walks might be more mental or psychological or helping the parasympathetic nervous system to kick in and help with bringing the stress down.

Yes, nice. I would say all of those various different things. Anaki DiLoperra was on the training science podcast and he, heavy emphasis and you read some of his, ⁓ his substacks and whatnot. Like walking is just so key. and yeah, there's, there's, there's this, you know, ⁓ call it L one or zone one work that we kind of do. And there's something, especially for runners.

And triathletes, there is a whole lot ⁓ of benefit for doing these long walks and having that as a regular occurrence in your program. you know, and Lawrence VanLeggen has worked with my athlete Andy Buescher before he won Ironman Lanzarote. It was one of the key things that he added into Andy's program. And, you know, it just makes a massive difference. ⁓

it's, you know, there's probably something to do with the parasympathetic ⁓ reactivation, as you mentioned, MJ, where you just handle more stress when you're doing these regular walks. Humans were just meant to do this. yeah, so if you are, again, I'm like, you can get it, go at this with different, different, different angles, right? So ⁓ there was, you know, there's a recent paper that just came out. ⁓

with respect to much ado about zone two. And it's like, you know, it was kind of almost talking more about, you know, emphasizing high intensity training. But if you have the time, you know, walks, regular walks are a very, very good thing. So context always, if you're in the situation where you only have 15 minutes in your day, probably hit is where you want to go. But ⁓ if you've got the time to do this, if you're in the...

endurance athlete bucket and you've got your 15 to 20 hours available to you a week. There's great benefits of having a little bit of walking in there. Using it as a commuting practice if you have it, even cycling or walking. Yeah, but it's nothing but of benefit to you to just general moving in your life.

Grant also asked is there an update on the professor's VO2H or MJ's PACE goal?

Yeah, so I'm working on it, Grant. I'll just go first there. So it is, yeah, so currently, I'm not sure if you can see, if you're on YouTube, it's 52. So I'm not doing so, it's okay, but I've got, I'm kind of in the build phase right now. So I'm putting in a little bit of training volume right now. So, you know, I think I'm, yeah, getting up there. Did a...

Nice. Yeah.

to a three hour and a two hour ride yesterday and just kind of lot of zone two and I'll be creating my adaptation energy and we're gonna add a little bit of hit. I'm gonna try to see if we can bump that up there. If I'm honest, it's gonna be a tough ask. This might be the year where it goes down, but can't be up there forever and I just gotta be okay with that.

⁓ Yeah, you gotta join, I guess I should get back home so I can start running the velocity heat sessions or you can join pulse velocity sessions.

Yeah.

Thank

Yeah. when you start those up again, MJ, when you get back to home base, I think I'm going to drop in and ⁓ I'm going do those with you.

MJ, what about your Pace goal?

have not ⁓ been on track with my 5K SUP20. I have not even tested it once. ⁓ I've been on the road for seven weeks. ⁓ But it's still on the bucket. It will be ⁓ maybe later this year. I'll go for it.

Good stuff. What are you getting up for right now, MJ? Can you tell the world?

I have no idea. Probably

23. I don't know. So it's a big ask. I don't think it's going to happen this year, but it's, I'm going to, I'm going to get there. And Grant says, unfortunately, I forgot your goal for this year, coach Warloski

I dunno, not-

Which is ironic since Grant is one of my athletes and as he, you know, but basically, uh, he is, you know, the, goal is to, um, work on gravel nationals in September. that's been progressing nicely. Athletic has been getting me on a, on a nice path and I've been making progress every month. So it's been good. So we'll talk in September, September 21st, I think is gravel nationals in Minnesota. So that's, that's the big target.

Right on, awesome.

Giuseppe85 on the athletic forum asks about hypoxic training, the hypoxicator. And I have no idea what that is. So he's asking us, you know, and maybe this is related. First of all, well, do we know what a hypoxicator is?

No, but I'm imagining it's some sort of a respiratory ⁓ contributor.

So his main question is,

we even do short aerobic running sessions one hour? Wouldn't it be better to increase the aerobic volume only with the bike to impact the joints last? Long runs specific for marathons and Ironman are fundamental. I'm talking about those runs during the week.

Hmm.

you

say a one hour run is a short one. It's totally relative to the athlete, right? Like for somebody, one hour run is a long one. ⁓ And people work. So probably practical reasons. Mostly you would have shorter runs during the week and then a longer one during the weekend. And of course, like

Yeah, yeah.

cycling, can use cycling, to build your aerobic base and, know, like he says, ⁓ to impact joints and neuromuscular load, ⁓ on the, on the bike is lot less. So you can build a good base, aerobic base on the bike. Long runs frequently. It's pretty taxing, especially for older athlete.

Hmm.

Yep. exactly. So context on all of these, right? So in a, we also know that, you know, accumulating an overall training volume, even if they're shorter runs is a better, like think about the distribution of your stress over your week, right? We know that that is a better, ⁓ strategy generally speaking than these larger, ⁓ longer runs.

through your week. you want to, if you're distributing those aerobic running stresses, neuromuscular stresses, the key one that you've got to navigate, that's a better strategy than just these big long ones, going out for two and three hour runs. So that's the general reason why athletic programs, those shorter, smaller ones. It's trying to distribute.

the overall training volume and it's trying to increase the total volume of running in the week, which we know benefits your performance. And we get this all the time on the forum athletes talk about. They can't believe it. They didn't have that long run in them, but yet they could push through at the end and maintain the higher overall pace. ⁓ Gordon Walker in New Zealand was my coach when I finally went under ⁓

10 hours for my Ironman and this was, you know, I was able to run free right through the end of the Ironman. And again, I only got up to about 28K as my overall long run in my training week, but my overall volume was getting up to, you know, 70 to 80K in that week, which was relatively good for me. And ⁓ I couldn't believe it as well. I had a massive, wow, this is amazing. I can't believe this is happening. And it was totally strong to the end. So that's why.

And remember like when you're, this is relative to the athlete, but if you're somebody who don't often do marathons, so Ironman's extending those long runs, you're also increasing the risk of injury or illness. don't know how many times I've seen, um, athlete push for that long run to gain confidence or like, Oh, I think I should do, you know, 20 miles or.

Mm-hmm.

34K run before my marathon and then a days after they get sick or they get injured. Like I don't know how many times I've seen this. So just be mindful when you want to do those long, long runs that you also increase the risk of injury or ⁓ illness. But of course, like if you, if you've constantly run and you have a good history behind you, then those long runs are not.

as you know taxing along to you anymore so context.

Is it Jack?

From the forum asks ⁓ questions about VO2Max. I was listening to an older user questions episode and there was a question about doing Arabic workouts in your race modality. I think it was trail running and doing the VO2Max workouts in a different modality. In this case, it was rowing.

If I understood it correctly in terms of VO2Max benefit, the modality shouldn't matter. If you're a runner and do a VO2Max or heat workout on a bike, in the pool or on rowing machine, you will get similar benefits in terms of VO2Max. Question one. Did I understand that correctly?

I would say generally yes, but the only key aspect that you gotta get your head around ⁓ is the concept of the neuromuscular stress that we've already brought forth in the podcast. in the two extremes, you're running neuromuscular stress. And when we say neuromuscular stress, think about like muscle soreness, muscle recruitment, know.

the, you know, any sort of thing, feeling of a bit of a niggle. ⁓ This is your neuromuscular system, right? How the nerves that integrate into the joints, muscles are feeding back, right? They're interpreting levels of integrity ultimately, whether it be, you know, soreness or whatnot. But that's going to be massively different in the running context versus the swimming context. In the running context,

versus the cycling context and in the running context versus the rowing context. that's how you sort of switch these sorts of things up. But you're right in that, you if you're, you know, you're trying to get a hit stimulus that impacts the heart and the lungs. And when I say lungs, I'm also referring to the respiratory muscles that drive those lungs, your lungs in terms of the alveolar components and whatnot that are, you know.

that it's not, we're not doing too sort of much there, but there is all of these muscles that surround, you know, the intercostals and the diaphragm and these can all be strengthens and they only really get strengthened under high engagement. And that's what you're trying to do. When we rock up to Paul or Marjaana's ⁓ you know, 30, 30 classes on velocity, this is what we're, this is one of the key components that we're working on there.

Right? Yeah. that's, we hear that and we see that with these high respiratory flow rates, right? We hear everyone breathing very hard on those workouts. We suffer together and that's why you're sort of doing those suffering ⁓ situations. And ⁓ on velocity in the bike, it's a relatively low neuromuscular stress. It's not too, too bad, especially in the context of running.

Question two may not be strictly VO2 max related. If I understand that correctly and I'm training mostly for five and 10k running races, what is the trade off if I do my 30 30s on an indoor bike? Are long Arabic runs enough to build running form efficiency?

Yeah, I I think we kind of, we kind of had this discussion a little bit when we talked about the Baz Van Hooren sort of situation, right? Ideally, you want to do these using the principle of specificity, but everyone has a different context, right? So if you're a young, resilient athlete, you're probably gonna be able to recover and handle that type of workout very easily, right? So Marianne is...

They're into running and they're super, she's seeing them, being so resilient with the training that they do. They don't get injured very easily ⁓ and they can recover really quickly. The three of us on the podcast, in our 50s or close to our 50s, we're a lot more vulnerable to those sorts of neuromuscular stresses and we need to navigate things a little more carefully. So again,

I'm not sure where you're sitting. I don't know if it's sort of Jeff or John or the Jay, but yeah, that's what you've got to navigate. So you've got to sort of for your situation, ideally stay in the specificity of running, but any niggles and you want to switch these things up to the bike.

Let's move on to a new question from Phil from the forum. He asks about fasted training. I really like this question. At aerobic endurance intensities, I can ride two, three, four hours and longer fasted, just taking on water. Just because I can, does that mean I should? What does the science say?

Phew.

⁓ That's a

Hahaha!

great question.

it's very timely because I just had a good podcast with ⁓ the author of a couple of papers that are making headlines. Her name is ⁓ Christy Storashuk and she wrote the paper on Much Ado About Zone 2 and then she also had ⁓

a paper that was also kind of checking the, you know, the claims behind just fasting period. So great conversation that should be coming out at a sort of a similar time that this one airs. So if you want, you know, a real, you know, a scientist that's heavy into these, and, you know, go and have a listen to that. Now you're almost kind of combining those two areas. So she was kind of, she was very skeptical, honestly, about

about any of the benefits of fasting period and of ⁓ zone two training period as well. if you want to kind of like, she's been very, she's having a note on Twitter with Steve Magnus. If you know Steve Magnus, he's sort of a famous ⁓ running guru and whatnot and say, well, this is the way endurance athletes train. And again, Phil, would kind of also, I would kind of go back to

there's this hybrid kind of thinking that we have to ⁓ take. And I think maybe the answer is that we don't have the science to support what you're sort of saying, but that doesn't mean that that isn't there, that doesn't exist. Because think about what you would have to do to actually know whether that, the answer to your question there, right? Like there's a lot of...

a lot of muscle biopsies that you would have to do. There's some very demanding training sessions that you would have to do, know, creating like a control group versus a fasting group. ⁓ And for me, in this hybrid sort of role between being a coach and being a scientist, I acknowledge that I don't know everything and I'm not gonna be in the...

what is it called, the during Walmersley curve, I'm not going to be at the top of Mount Stupid ultimately in terms of that, looking at that curve. I just, we don't know everything yet. And I often follow a lot of the cyclists and the cycling coaches. And it was Mark Quad who wrote the cycling chapter for science and application of high intensity interval training. ⁓ And he told me, you know, that ⁓ like,

Fasted training has been done by elite cycling coaches since the 50s. It's just not, it's very, very common ⁓ that they do that sort of practice. So they're out there at you know, sort of the forefront recommending these things for their elite cyclists. There must be, there's probably something there, but we don't have the science to kind of back it up. So it's, ⁓ yeah, and yeah, I'll start with that and maybe you guys have some follow ups.

was just listening to Fast Talk Labs recent podcast about durability and they were saying exactly the same, like coaches have done things for decades that science can't back up. And one of the things was the fasted training and they were talking exactly what you just mentioned that cyclists like pro cyclists do a lot of fasted training, but we don't necessarily want to recommend it to everyday athletes.

and ⁓

I don't know, they didn't touch it more why they wouldn't recommend it. But I mean, a lot of people, can't have anything in their stomach before going to work out. They wake up early, are not hungry. And to me, from practical reasons, I would say, if that's what works for you, go ahead, but make sure that you get enough food in you afterwards, right?

Oftentimes we're thinking about, you know, reds and lower energy availability. But I mean, like, who doesn't eat like crazy after a basket training? Like I am so hungry the rest of the day and I am mindful that I need to keep eating and getting that energy in.

Yep.

Yep. Nice. So my context, again, we sort of started in this podcast. talked about, I was telling you about my, you know, camping and being, you know, ⁓ being off in the, wilderness with these amazing cycling roads that happen to be there as well. All my rides were fasted. ⁓ But just to MJ's point, when I came back and finished these, I ate the house down, but it's like, but actually, I actually prefer the fasted situation.

for my training. And when I was speaking with Sean Seiko, who's this famous fasted cyclist on Twitter and elsewhere, he was saying, you really got to think about what happens when you add fuel into your GI tract. when you add fuel in there,

You've got to actually, your body has to devote blood flow to that area in order to be able to process and digest that. So you really got to kind of consider that. And his belief was, and he really got me thinking about this, is, you know, his belief is by doing that and not actually requiring any demands on your GI tract, right? When I was saying GI tract, I'm talking the whole apparatus from the stomach to the small intestine, the large intestine. You sort of just taking everything away from there.

And it can go to the work, the blood flow can go to the working muscles solely to do the job that it's doing and just work on all the resources that you have there. ⁓ So I liked what that kind of thinking and I go with that as well in my own sort of training. just, feel so freed when just to be able to, and empowered to be able to do three, four hours riding in the mountains, no problem.

That's a very powerful sort of thing. But, MJ's point, there's a real big context there. If you've never done this before, you probably don't want to start with three, four hours or six or eight like these other elites are sort of doing. You want to start with where you're at, lengthening out the time, always having something in reserve if you're going to play around and try this. Because we probably know now ⁓ that it's really all about being, you know,

maintaining your blood glucose level, preventing hypoglycemia, ⁓ preventing the blood glucose level of your small glucose pool from getting too low so that your brain is a happy, happy brain.

Recently, Athletica slightly changed its pre-bike race routine so that the primer is two days before the race and the day before we're doing an easy 30-minute ride with some spin-ups. What's the best way to prepare the day before an event?

What do you like, MJ?

I like to do just a super short, ⁓ like I would totally do the easy 30 minutes with some spin ups. I've already done some primers earlier that week, but the day before it's more for the nerves than anything else.

As Paul would say, hey is in the barn, right?

Hmm.

The hay is in the barn.

Pays in the bone, yeah.

Yeah, I would say the same. It's

context. There's no right or wrong way to do it in race week because it's going to often is dictated by the context of your travel if you're racing into a new location. Get that right first and foremost, move things around. Like MJ said, nice to have a primer in a few days prior, day before the race. Just keep it easy, keep it light.

few little pickups, but nothing more. It's done and dusted, anything for the nerves, that's it. And the only other thing I will add on this is please tell us what your thoughts are on the new ⁓ psychological, I guess, messaging that's coming from your AI coach. So the team have done a lot of work on that AI coach in the background.

Thank

to, you know, alongside myself to try to get, put you into the mind's state of mind to execute your race. So let us know your thoughts if that's improved or not ⁓ compared to what we had there before.

Yeah, I've definitely noticed.

I'll let you know after

my race this week.

Okay, be listening, that's right. MJ's doing Iron Man 70.3 Calgary. Go MJ, go Cindy as well. She's doing her other buddy Cindy.

Yay!

All right.

Yeah, Cindy.

Yep. It'll be fun.

forget to take part on the field study.

Yes, thank you MJ. So field study, fueling's influence on exercise load and development. So yeah, this is a field study where you can actually ⁓ enter in, connect your wearable data into Athletica and then fill out a short 15 minute questionnaire on your own fueling practices.

low carb, high carb, anything in between. ⁓ it's, we're, we're getting, there's, there's some solid respondents already, but we want even more. We're going to keep this, this open. ⁓ And yeah, the power of the Athletica platform, I'll just also say as a research platform is becoming phenomenal. So the latest paper from Dr. Andreas Agnoli, he kindly added myself on this as well.

is just published in ⁓ SPSR, Sports Performance Science Reports, Martin Breschite's journal. And this includes the most amazing analysis on ⁓ semantic analysis or sentiment analysis. Now that's a big word for how your comments relate to how you feel. Are they actually... ⁓

Are they expressing joy or are you expressing sadness? And everything sort of else in between. And this is phenomenal. Andrea and I believe that this will be a tool that coaches and even AI coaches will use to ⁓ assess your training load response, right? Just like your heart rate variability. And yeah, so this is the very first incidence or a report of this.

Thanks.

It's done from you, the Athletica users, and we are cutting, you know, we're at the, we're cutting edge and we're trailblazing right now. And I could not be more proud of the whole team that brings this work together. And this is really what the vision of Athletica was from the, from the, from the start where the laboratory would go out into the field, just like, just like the field study. So the field study is the next version in the nutrition ⁓ space.

of this important research that's out there. So get on board with the field study, everyone. Check out Andrea's latest paper on SPSR. Some blogs are coming out very shortly on this. ⁓ yeah, guys, it's been a super fun podcast. Thank you for all the questions.

Thanks for the questions and let them ⁓ keep bringing them to our forum and to the Facebook and social medias. Thanks for listening today to the Athletes Compass podcast. Take a moment now, subscribe, share, and let's keep navigating this endurance adventure together. Improve your training with the science-based training platform, Athletica, and join the conversation at the Athletica Forum.

For Marjaana Rakai and Dr. Paul Laursen I'm Paul Warloski and this has been the Athletes Compass Podcast. Thank you so much for listening.